Podcast #68: Slouching toward Idiocracy

38 October 18, 2015 by

68_finalIn this episode of Drunk Ex-Pastors, Jason and Christian discuss whether excessive drinking is really as harmful as all the experts unanimously warn (turns out it’s fine). We then discuss a recent documentary about The Shining, seeking to determine whether Kubrick was really the genius his most devoted fans insist he was, or whether those fans need to move out of their parents’ basements and do something more constructive. We take a couple brief calls about guns, as well as give some marital advice, ironically, to a caller with a conservative wife. We then turn our attention to the issue of technology’s effects on our culture, and whether democratizing the flow of information is worth how stupid it’s making us. Jason is biebered by his looming death, while Christian’s bieber involves uncharitable hermeneutical practices.

Also, cock rings? Discuss. . . .

Links from this Episode:

38 Comments (click here to leave a comment)

  1. Maybe I wasn’t looking for name to be mentioned. Maybe I was just thought your entertainment value to me has increased and I want my pledge to reflect that. You’re welcome. =)

  2. From the drug harm article:
    Prof Nutt told the BBC: “Overall, alcohol is the most harmful drug because it’s so widely used.

    “Crack cocaine is more addictive than alcohol but because alcohol is so widely used there are hundreds of thousands of people who crave alcohol every day, and those people will go to extraordinary lengths to get it.”

    This suggests that the data are not corrected for the number of users. The fact that so many more people use alcohol than any of these other drugs but the harms of alcohol are not so much greater than the other drugs’ suggests that alcohol is remarkably unharmful. Also, crime is included in the societal costs. I wonder if they controlled for the fact that a lot of the drug crime results from the mere fact that many of these drugs are illegal, i.e., what would the societal costs of heroin be if you could buy it from your pharmacist?

    Maybe these questions were answered in the article, but the BBC write up was complete bollocks.

  4. On the living in echo chambers, I shifted from being very liberal to very conservative about a decade ago, and I realized that in both instances I was inside an echo chamber of opinion. So I try to avoid that now, and I find it keeps me honest. For example, I follow atheist, Catholic, Reformed blogs, and have both liberal/conservative vocal friends on FB. I rarely block or unfriend anyone. So when some news story is breaking I will see the knee jerk reaction from one group, and the pointing out of the obvious (to them) error being made by the opposite group. I feel like I’ve been saved from being an idiot a few times, but it makes my news feed annoying at times.

    Also on the democratizing of information, and losing the gate keepers of knowledge. This seems like an out crop of post modernism of our culture at large. The perspective of the once trusted gate keepers have been reduced to that of average opinion. So the plus is you get more voices that might have otherwise been unduly suppressed, but at the price of losing the objective value of some views. I’m sure you guys have read The Abolition of Man by CS Lewis. This loss of value is exactly what he was talking about in that book with regard to education. Here is a good quote:

    “For every one pupil who needs to be guarded against a weak excess of sensibility there are three who need to be awakened from the slumber of cold vulgarity. The task of the modern educator is not to cut down jungles but to irrigate deserts. The right defence against false sentiments is to inculcate just sentiments. By starving the sensibility of our pupils we only make them easier prey to the propagandist when he comes. For famished nature will be avenged and a hard heart is no infallible protection against a soft head.

  5. Random thoughts:

    • I will shop on your Amazon link for my Xmas presents in a couple of weeks, because I love my loved ones enough to buy them a present, but not quite enough to physically go to the mall during the Xmas season.

    • Yes, I did just use “Xmas” there. War on Christmas, people.

    • Tomorrow, I will be 10 weeks without alcohol. I don’t really miss it anymore. Though again, I have discovered that I really don’t enjoy some of the TV shows I used to watch now that I’m not buzzed/drunk when I watch them.

    • As your tolerance for alcohol (or your weight) increases, you will have to drink more to get the same feeling.

    • The dangers of heroin and most other contraband drugs is that because they are illegal and there is no legal oversight of their production, you don’t know what the dealer is cutting it with or the potency of the drug so you can easily overdose on it.

    • Of course, given what happened to Lamar Odom, that is also the danger with Herbal Supplements.

    • So, I guess fuck vitamins and go use heroin.

    • I kid, I kid.

    • Aaron Sorkin is 54.

    • Shelley Duvall was in the Shining. Shelley Long was in Cheers.

    • This is way more time discussing The Shining that it deserves.

    • Now Maximum Overdrive, on the other hand…

    • I think Francis Shaffer put it best this week when he said we have a religious gun cult in this country that has its own belief system, tenets, apologia, and blind faith. Challenging this, challenges their god and they react the way any fundamentalist does when his god is challenged.

    • Speaking of poisoning, you don’t see really any mass poisonings. And it would probably be far easier and create a higher body count to bring in poisoned donuts to your job or college than it would be to bring in a gun. Yet the weapon of choice remains the gun.

    • Meh, if I ever plan on killing myself, I’m going with seppuku.

    • Do guns stop crime? Sometimes. Do other countries with stronger gun control suffer greater incidents of violent crime? No, not really. So somehow they manage to find a way to not become victims despite not having easy access to guns.

    • If I see the fucking meme one more time on Facebook about how Washington DC, Chicago, etc. are so violent despite having gun control laws I’m going to scream and just post “Fuck you” 100x in response.

    • I would tell my wife that if she gets bumper space, I get bumper space too and then I would post a Planned Parenthood sticker opposite hers.

    • It was much more awesome being a doctor in the early 20th century.

    • My wife and I cannot talk about religion really since I’ve become a squishy universalist liberal. Fortunately, I have converted her to the dark side of the political force.

    • Some people like to fight.

    • There is something to be said about giving people a voice. The problem with the internet is people. Specifically:

    o Some people treat every voice on the internet equally. Thus the scientist with two doctorates in climate science and chemistry is given the same amount of weight as the CFO of Exxon Mobile.

    o Some people get stuck in echo chambers where they are not challenged, every opinion they see agrees with them, and dissenters are punished and viewed as stupid or disloyal.

    o Vulgarity. Not just profanity, but our base animal nature that seems to enjoy spectacle for spectacle’s sake. Thus our ‘popular’ culture that venerates the Kardashians.

    o Anonymity. People become real assholes the second they can hide behind a pseudonym. Speaking of which, I suppose I should stop posting under a pseudonym. My name is Chris and I’m a bleeding heart liberal who uses bad words and struggles with faith.

    • Maybe we should work harder at imparting critical thinking skills and greater skepticism to school kids so they can more accurately discern the bullshit that is out there.

    • I think we really need to work on unplugging from the internet, from our phones, from screens in general. But I could just be a cranky old fart.

    • This is what I love about Drunk Ex-Pastors, after Jason gives an impassioned talk about how the internet is destroying culture and we need to do something, Christian mentions that he was sitting on the toilet reading Entertainment Weekly. lol

    • “We are the Borg. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated. Here’s your iPhone and Google glasses. Now on your way to your cubicle…”

    • Christian, I will only take you up on your anti-tech bomb if it spares scientific and medical diagnostic equipment. Despite my earlier joke about doctors, I don’t want to go back to frontier medicine.

    • The dick move reminds me of the trope of the IT guy working on the Death Star. It’s the best job he’s ever had. He gets great pay and benefits. He’s talking to his wife about buying a little cottage on Naboo and starting a family, and then Luke Skywalker comes along and bombs his office and kills him.

    • God speaks so clearly in the bible about the rapture that no one in His church for 1800 years realized it was magically there.

    • Now there’s a dick move by God: the flood. You have to wonder what all of the babies and toddlers and the majority of the animals did to piss Him off. But I’ve been told on Facebook that everyone deserves to be killed and eternally tortured by God because Adam and Eve ate an apple once.

    • The “I don’t want to know” mentality is why men typically die younger than women.

    • Yeah, yeah, we’re dying and mortality sucks. Have an antidepressant and some Xanax. It makes the waiting easier.

    • History is a tricky thing. And dealing with the noxious views that were predominant among people is a difficult thing. People are complex creatures and you will never find one that is all good or all bad.

  7. Thanks for making me look up seppuku. .!.

    Please post a screenshot of the meme you comment “Fuck you!” on 100x.

    In my defense, I was actually reading the Entertainment Weekly MAGAZINE (not the iPad version) which I have subscribed to for about 8 years! (But then I did go on to read Dan Savage’s book on my Kindle.)

  9. Dudes, the conversation about technology and blogs and music and how dumb I am becoming because I have created my own little bubble, has me percolating on what/who I should be reading, but also brings up an interesting thought, given our cultural moment: As a postmodern fellow, I am suspicious of authority, ‘must-reads’, ‘professional’ critics. I used to be a reformed Christian, now I often feel ‘free’, but often directionless and lazy. I used to read like a fiend, but now I have an aversion to books, and ‘learning’, since I feel such a distrust toward those in power. Obviously, a lot of this has to do with my own baggage I carry, but I am wanting to grow, which, alas, means learning and reading, barf.

    On that note, and with my blithering preamble, I think you dudes should put together a list of 10 ‘must read’ books that you think might help people (like me) who have been stupefied, be less stupid, and more engaged in the world as it is. Love what you two ass fairies (term of endearment) are doing.

    Dick. Bush. Out.

  10. For a second (until I googled), I thought you were reading Michael Savage! I was like: there is no way.

  12. Thanks, but it’s just me, Comrade Dread. Figured I couldn’t bitch about folks being anonymous on the internet and keep using a pseudonym myself. 🙂

  13. I know, I actually didn’t catch that you changed your name on your profile until just now. I saw the pic and the Random thoughts comment.

  14. Well then I’m not so sure what the point is. The second study is much more specific than the first, but it doesn’t really say anything all that interesting. Here’s a question for you two. You’ve mentioned Huxley numerous times on the podcast, and always with reference to a Brave New World. But Huxley was also a curious experimenter with mescaline and wrote about it in a very thought provoking short essay called “Through the Doors of Perception.” In the essay he talks about his transcendent experience with the world around him and its affect on his understanding of important experiences like art and religion. Other hallucinogens like DMT have been used similarly for millennia. Do you agree with the idea that insights gained in such and altered state of consciousness can grasp a bit of the Truth that might be otherwise inaccessible? Jason, you should read it. Christian, you should take some mescaline. And then you should discuss for our benefit.

  16. Like an idiot, I forgot to use your amazon link to order your dude wipes. But I remembered to use it when ordered a roku!

  18. I would recommend just dropping acid. It’s a sure thing. The answer to your question is HELL YES your mind will be opened and your perception of reality altered. You gain a real appreciation for the mental and perception. Of course, of you have a bad trip it can leave you devastated…. use with caution. Mind your set and setting.

  19. If meditation is like a gentle sail, mescaline is strapping yourself to a rocket. Just as bad ass too. Some people opt for a room with tunes and a tv…. But nature is the way to go. You live in Washington so beauty should be easy to find. DO IT and then report back 🙂

  21. There’s definitely a safe version of dropping acid (LSD) but even without going the pharmaceutical route there’s:

    * ayahuasca (or the US native american version, peyote)
    * mushrooms

    But caveats still apply for both of these as far as getting high quality stuff.

  22. BTW, from your comment, I’m assuming you’ve dropped? It’s interesting because I’ve never met anyone who’s done LSD (or similar hallucinogenics) who have remained/become conservative. But maybe that says more about me than you.

  23. I don’t want to knock conservatives (too much) and while it is true that epistemic closure exists on both sides, this is yet again another one of those situations where both sides are equally guilty.

    Look at all of the truths (read: conspiracy theories) that conservatives believe in compared to those on the liberal side. There are still plenty of Republicans who sincerely believe that Obama is a communist muslim from kenya. Why do they believe that? Partly because prominent figures on the Right continue to peddle that falsehood.

  24. You must have forgotten what it was like with Bush. We’ve had eight years of attacks by the right but it was just as bad with W. The media age has changed everything….. The more everything changed the more it stays the same.

  25. Yeah I’ve tripped on several different psychedelics. For me DMT was the most intense. LSD and hydro mushrooms the most thoughtful and enjoyable. I was not the slightest concerned with politics at that point in my life. I really don’t Have any beef with liberal policies (besides abortion) as much as I don’t respect their moral compass.

  26. And it all started with Bill Clinton. But the vitriol was/is never as bad from liberals as it is from conservatives.

    There may have been Democrats who crowed about how Bush stole the election but 1. that was never the view that was embraced by mainstream Democrats, 2. nobody ever questioned his citizenship.

    Do you realise that Barack Obama is the first ever president who ever published his birth certificate? Why do you think that is.

  27. Yeah, by that I mean hallucinogens tend to be substances that expanded people’s horizons and everybody I know who’s ever done it have become more open and accepting of others.

    Maybe not exactly making people Democrats but certainly more leaning towards that end of the spectrum.

  29. Liberals are just as bad as conservatives. I was cursed (“eff Bush”) and spit at in Europe while I was in the Navy. One of my friends was jumped in France and received a facial fracture around his eye.

  30. No I didn’t experience anything like peace and good will towards man. But my horizons were definitely expanded and it was the beginning of my intellectual curiosity.

  31. Dude, it certainly was the view of mainstream democrats and is still to this day. W was at once the world’s biggest moron and most brilliant evil genius. Depended on the mood of any given liberal commentator. But it certainly did start with Bill Clinton. Now that big media has taken control, effectively killing real journalism, we can expect more of the same from here in out.

    The next president will almost certainly be whoever takes the GOP nomination and then we will be right back with liberal smear campaigns and hack jobs.

  32. Re: Margaret Sanger, here is the irony of ironies: She was anti-a abortion! Seriously, this a quote from her “[a]lthough abortion may be resorted to in order to save the life of the
    mother, the practice of it merely for limitation of offspring is
    dangerous and vicious.” Planned Parenthood put abortion under the umbrella of “reproductive rights” after she died. Just think of the traction the pro-life movement could get if they stopped distorting her legacy, not only has ‘Jane Roe of Roe’ v Wade become pro-life but so was the founder of the #1 abortion provider in the US! She saw birth control as means to prevent the common back-alley abortions that were common in big cities.

  33. I agree. Inside tends toward an indulgent cartoon adventure, whereas outside tends towards the contemplative journey.

  35. While I think that extreme Liberals and Conservatives (more than just the extreme) can be equal in vitriol, it’s mainly the Conservatives who seem to be mostly unwilling to work with people across the aisle. When a Republican is in office, the Liberal response may be, “Well, we have to work with this asshole, so let’s do what we have to do,” while the Conservative response generally seems to be, “Let’s do everything we can to not only not work with this asshole but to sabotage the whole political process if he doesn’t do what we want.”

    I think much of it has to do with Conservatives believing they have a moral mandate handed to them by God, while Liberals don’t believe in such a mandate for themselves.

    Of course, I’m generalizing here. I’m sure there are exceptions on both sides.

  38. It just seems that way because we haven’t had a republican president with a democratic house in ages. Both are just different sides of the same coin. Different day same shit. It’s only distressing if you buy into the narrative. I personally don’t think the GOP gives a rats ass about abortion, marriage, etc. Just like I don’t think most of these old white men and women running for Dem really care about the poor. They are just saying what needs to be said to stay in power. The media makes it easy. The revolving door keeps spinning….. Bush, Clinton, Bush, Clinton, Kennedy, whatever. Big money stays big and the connected go global.

    Who cares? My life is good to hell with D.C.

    Vote with your pocketbook. It’s much more effective

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