Podcast #70: Jay Bakker Interview

15 November 1, 2015 by

70_finalIn this episode the Drunk Ex-Pastors interview pastor-author Jay Bakker, “Christian agnostic” and son of Jim and Tammy Faye. We begin with a disavowal of anything we say since we do absolutely no research before weighing in on a topic, after which (to Christian’s annoyance) Jay and Jason talk about skateboarding for way too long. Jay relays his first and only experience with our former church, Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa, which reduced him to tears (not the good kind). Jay then describes his experience becoming a gay-affirming Christian leader, which went pretty much how you would expect it to, after which he tells us about his church, Revolution. Our discussion then veers to the topic of the weakness and humanity of Christian leaders, and finally to the subject of the relationship of faith and doubt.

Also, an “Orange County accent”? Psssssh! I am so. Sure.

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15 Comments (click here to leave a comment)

  1. It was an interesting interview. Growing up in conservative churches where the Bakkers were vilified for false doctrine or their televised personas and where the fall of Jim was greeted with unconcealed glee, it was fascinating getting a picture into their humanity. I had no idea that his mom was among the first Christians to recognize the AIDS epidemic and start caring for the afflicted.

    Though I suppose given the attitude towards AIDS among conservative churches at the time, we probably never would have heard of that except as a negative.

    Christians can be real dicks to one another.

    People pretend in Christianity because of fear. Fear of looking bad. Fear that if someone, anyone in their congregation isn’t the ideal Christian, if no one can ‘attain’ it, then maybe it isn’t true. So we put on an acting performance every week.

    Would our churches fall apart if we all came out and admitted that no one is there? That we’re all struggling with shit? That we’re all muddling through trying to figure it out? Would pastors and priests lose their moral authority if they were no longer seen as moral examples and paragons of virtue? Is the fear of vulnerability leading us to the sin of pride?

    Christian agnostic. I like that term. I have hope, but I’m not sure what exactly is going to happen when I die. It would be much easier if God would do a podcast and take questions and settle the matter once and for all.

    It’s the Godcast with your host Jehovah… topic for today “I didn’t really write Leviticus, Moses and a few priests did, so stop blaming Me…”

    Next week’s topic: “Why Cancer wards for children exist…”

  2. I have a lot of respect for someone who willing undertakes suffering to standup for their conscience. Even if I disagree with their position.

  4. Great episode guys. I’ve listening to Jay’s Revolution podcast for a few mounths now, since I completely gave up on the Orthodox Presbyterian Church my family atends, and he has really chalenged me to be a lot more tolerant towards those I disagree with.

  6. The Kevin Smith movie Jay was referring to is called Tusk. It’s got Justin Long and Haley Joel Osment in it. Johnny Depp plays a secondary character too. Awfully good movie. Nowhere near as awful as Human Centipede though.

  7. This was great. As to Jay’s comment that we’re wired to love, if we take anything away from the creation story in Genesis, shouldn’t it be that we as humans all share in the image of the Divine? If I my humanity is a reflection of the image of God, and God is love, the thing that makes me human is love. If your humanity is a reflection of the image of God, and I claim to love God, I must love you.

  8. But there are people who report to have had near death experiences of Hell. You can find a bunch on Youtube.

  9. Here’s one for your next dick move, God:

    “Okay, Abraham, this land is all going to be yours and your descendants.”

    “What about the people currently occupying it?”

    “I’m going to kill them off.”

    “So like Sodom and Gomorrah then?”

    “No, your great great grandkids will do it.”

    “Okay…I don’t understand, they seem like okay folks an all, but okay…”

    “Well, they’re not. They’re really horrible people. So I’m going to judge them. But not for another 400 years because I want to give them a chance to repent.”

    “So you want me to go tell them about you and your laws then?”

    “No, I’m going to send you and your kids to Egypt.”

    “But how are they going to know they should stop being dicks if I don’t tell them.”

    “Don’t worry about it.”

    “And why would we go down to Egypt? It’s nice here.”

    “It’s a bit complex, but I want to judge Egypt to, so your great-grandkid will be sold into slavery, then wrongfully accused, thrown into prison, and then raised up to become the number two guy in Egypt, where he will save them from a famine, but sell all of the Egyptians into slavery, who will they turn around and enslave your people, so I can kill all of the first born in Egypt and lead your people out of slavery into the Promised Land… after they wander around for 40 years and all of the people I lead out of Egypt die… but after that… and the genocide I order them to commit… the land is theirs… until the piss me off too…”

    “That’s messed up.”

    “Yeah, you should see what I did to Job.”

  10. Yes, but how much of that is real, and how much of that is the brain’s perception of itself dying, combined with fear, religious iconography, and unresolved issues?

  15. I feel like 80% of the stories in the Old Testament could work as part of the dick move God segment.

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